multiple personalities ftw?
multiple personalities ftw?
TWT, please for once, I beg you, give in to historical data and historical proof instead of your own preconceived notions! Pope Innocent III led the Papacy to its height of power and prestige!
http://www.fordham.edu/Halsall/pgc.a....html#Innocent III: The Papacy at its Height
http://www.nndb.com/people/536/000092260/
http://academics.witcc.com/language_...HCH09Notes.htm
Conrad, I used your own sources to disprove your thesis, to get deeper into this I will have to get the Chronicles of the Crusade, a copy of Lateran, and the Letters of Innocent, Boniface, Montefeat, and others which I don't happen to have laying around my apartment as I did not exspect this topic to provoke this debateQuote:
Originally Posted by Conrad_Jalowski
Please, TWT, it is fine to make mistakes. Just admit it and let us continue with the discussion.
Conrad, your own sorces said that he was not the greatest Pope, how is that my mistake, also this if getting off topic and has nothing to do with weather the Church was the Succesor to Rome
The sources stated that he was the most powerful pope in terms of the power and prestige of the Papacy. That is historical fact!
Conrad - 1
TWT - 0
At Best this is an opinion, and 'Innocent III, the Greatest of the Popes after Gregory' how does this equate to the Greatest Pope Ever?Quote:
Originally Posted by Conrad_Jalowski
And how powerfull and prestiges could he have been when the Doge so openly defied him?
The Greatest Pope title is debatable, just like Greatest President or Greatest Emperor. They are based on personal opinions, and are NOT set in stone.
TWT, your theory on the Catholic Church being a continuation of the Roman Empire is indeed intriguing, I have never heard it before. However, I would say that the Papacy has fallen as well. While the Catholic Church is still around, it no longer has anywhere near the power it once did. I would consider the Great Reformation to signal the start of the decline of the Papacy, but I am not exactly an expert on this particular time period.
On to my opinion of the posed question:
I believe it was mostly internal issues that brought Rome to its knees, and the Byzantines after that. Corruption in the government is often the cause of the fall of empires. This rule goes from the Roman and Byzantine Empires, to the Third Reich.
Neither the size of an Empire, nor its military can save it from having irresponsible, or otherwise incapable men at the helm.
Heraclius, I and the historical data have not stated that Pope Innocent III was the greatest pope as that is opinion. What is fact is that under him the Papacy reached its height in prestige and power.