Battle Mechanics 101+ Discussion

[Viceicarious]

Battle mechanics...

Well not many people have enough knowledge base to derive an accurate portrayal of the combat mechanics in this game. Through reverse mathematics, comparison, and analyzing; I have derived a few theories...
If you can correct or add to these let me know, this will be an ongoing discussion and I will reserve 2 threads after this one for 2 different sections of mechanics, as I will split the discussion up.(This discussion will not be about tech levels, or wall levels as I believe everyone should know these already)

Targeting Priority Key:

CumAtk- means the unit targets the enemy with highest cumulative attack.

R- targets units in this order... 1st ranged w/ highest CumAtk focusing only on ranged units unit no more exist, then 2nd the units with highest CumAtk. and so on.

M- targets melee units with highest cumulative attack.

S- targets units closest to them regardless of range or attack value


I. ATTACKING:

#1. Troop types and targeting:

Workers-S
Warriors-S
Scouts- CumAtk
Swordsmen- S
Pikemen- S
Archer- M+CumAtk, then R+CumAtk
Cavalry- M, then R
Cataphract- M, then R
Transporter- S
Ballistae- M+CumAtk, then R+CumAtk
Battering Ramms- S
Catapult- M+CumAtk, then R+CumAtk


II: DEFENCE

1. Defending wall units:

a. traps- Affect ALL units except Battering Ramms, Catapult, and Ballistae
b. Abatis- Affect only horse units
c. Rollinglogs- Affect ALL units except horse units
-Damage (or kill count) 1.5x against battering ramms
d. Archer Towers- Affects ALL units using R+CumAtk, then M+CumAtk
e. Defensive Trebuchet(a.k.a. Rockfall)- Affects ALL units
-Damage (or kill count) 1.5x against ALL siege units
(Battering Ramms, Catapult, Ballistae, and even Transporters)


A. Kill Ratios for single use units:

Abatis- 10% atk mounted units
Traps- 10% attack per round
Rollinglogs- same as traps
Rockfall- same as above

B. Archer Tower kills-

I have noticed these towers if attacking while gates are closed can be taken out with minimal losses by using the following formula:

[Ignoring any hero bonuses]
Attacking Ranged units total health minus (AT's CumAtk minus ranged units CumDef) this gives you how many units will die per round, and you will have to figure for each range unit type independently. Then find how many total ranged units you can send minimum depending on how many rounds it takes your swordsmen to reach the walls depending on your compass level.
You will then send this # of archers, plus one ballistae, and one catapult, send one of each other melee unit that is SLOWER than swords, and the remaining troops up to your rally point level send as swordsmen.... then you will take out AT's with minimal losses.

This is only if there are no traps, rockfall, or rollinglogs.

2. Defending troop types and targeting:

Worker- S
Warrior- S
*Scout- then CumAtk
Swordsmen- S
Pikemen- S
*Archers- R+CumAtk, then CumAtk
(this is where transporters can die ahead of other troop types)
Cavalry- CumAtk
Cataphract- CumAtk
*Transporters- S
*Ballistae- R+CumAtk, then M+CumAtk
**Battering Ramms- S
*Catapult- R+CumAtk, then M+CumAtk
AT's- R+CumAtk, then M+CumAtk

*- unit stays in walls
**- Battering Ramms do not hurt Cavalry or Cataphract


III. Bonuses/Penalties to combat

Bonuses are applied to not only attack power, but also are applied to life and defence...Penalties seem to be the same.

1. Swordsmen- 1.5x bonus against Archers, and AT's
2. Cavalry- 1.5x penalty against pikemen
3. Cataphract- 1.5x penalty against pikemen
4. Pikemen- 1.5x bonus against ALL horseunits
5. Ballistae, Catapult- 1.5x penalty to Rockfall
6. Battering Ramms- 1.5x penalty to Rollinglogs


thats it for now....soon I will have more.

[Viceicarious]

Spot Reserved

[Asmo]

I see the future it involves Lord Arumen having a talk with you about guides and looking at other posts

[stepfaster]

nice post, will keep an eye on this for future discussions

[wmdHost]

Battle mechanics...

Well not many people have enough knowledge base to derive an accurate portrayal of the combat mechanics in this game. Through reverse mathematics, comparison, and analyzing; I have derived a few theories...
If you can correct or add to these let me know, this will be an ongoing discussion and I will reserve 2 threads after this one for 2 different sections of mechanics, as I will split the discussion up.(This discussion will not be about tech levels, or wall levels as I believe everyone should know these already)

Targeting Priority Key:

CumAtk- means the unit targets the enemy with highest cumulative attack.

R- targets units in this order... 1st ranged w/ highest CumAtk focusing only on ranged units unit no more exist, then 2nd the units with highest CumAtk. and so on.

M- targets melee units with highest cumulative attack.

S- targets units closest to them regardless of range or attack value


I. ATTACKING:

#1. Troop types and targeting:

Workers-S
Warriors-S
Scouts- CumAtk
Swordsmen- S
Pikemen- S
Archer- M+CumAtk, then R+CumAtk
Cavalry- M, then R
Cataphract- M, then R
Transporter- S
Ballistae- M+CumAtk, then R+CumAtk
Battering Ramms- S
Catapult- M+CumAtk, then R+CumAtk


II: DEFENCE

1. Defending wall units:

a. traps- Affect ALL units except Battering Ramms, Catapult, and Ballistae
b. Abatis- Affect only horse units
c. Rollinglogs- Affect ALL units except horse units
-Damage (or kill count) 1.5x against battering ramms
d. Archer Towers- Affects ALL units using R+CumAtk, then M+CumAtk
e. Defensive Trebuchet(a.k.a. Rockfall)- Affects ALL units
-Damage (or kill count) 1.5x against ALL siege units
(Battering Ramms, Catapult, Ballistae, and even Transporters)


A. Kill Ratios for single use units:

This is where I am lost for the most part.....I will tell you all what I have noticed about these, see if you can lend a helping hand here.

Traps- depends on tech levels...
heros intelligence affects melee units ability to move around these
Rollinglogs- depends on tech levels
Rockfall- depends on tech levels

B. Archer Tower kills-

I have noticed these towers if attacking while gates are closed can be taken out with minimal losses by using the following formula:

[Ignoring any hero bonuses]
Attacking Ranged units total health minus (AT's CumAtk minus ranged units CumDef) this gives you how many units will die per round, and you will have to figure for each range unit type independently. Then find how many total ranged units you can send minimum depending on how many rounds it takes your swordsmen to reach the walls depending on your compass level.
You will then send this # of archers, plus one ballistae, and one catapult, send one of each other melee unit that is SLOWER than swords, and the remaining troops up to your rally point level send as swordsmen.... then you will take out AT's with minimal losses.

This is only if there are no traps, rockfall, or rollinglogs.

2. Defending troop types and targeting:

Worker- S
Warrior- S
*Scout- then CumAtk
Swordsmen- S
Pikemen- S
*Archers- R+CumAtk, then CumAtk
(this is where transporters can die ahead of other troop types)
Cavalry- CumAtk
Cataphract- CumAtk
*Transporters- S
*Ballistae- R+CumAtk, then M+CumAtk
**Battering Ramms- S
*Catapult- R+CumAtk, then M+CumAtk
AT's- R+CumAtk, then M+CumAtk

*- unit stays in walls
**- Battering Ramms do not hurt Cavalry or Cataphract


III. Bonuses/Penalties to combat

Bonuses are applied to not only attack power, but also are applied to life and defence...Penalties seem to be the same.

1. Swordsmen- 1.5x bonus against Archers, and AT's
2. Cavalry- 1.5x penalty against pikemen
3. Cataphract- 1.5x penalty against pikemen
4. Pikemen- 1.5x bonus against ALL horseunits
5. Ballistae, Catapult- 1.5x penalty to Rockfall
6. Battering Ramms- 1.5x penalty to Rollinglogs


thats it for now....soon I will have more.

simple way to say that....

1. for range units.... suppose they have many units in their atk range.. they will hit the longest range troop first. when all ranged attk targets die they ll go for highest atk block (atk block = cummalative attk in ur terms)

2. for mele attk units, they will target the highest atk block when they have more than one in their hit range.


ats.. well they will shoot the ranged atks first if they have a choice ...
simple calc... 17k ats + 30k bows = 100k bow atk dead.
for taking out pure ats... think about a wave like scouts cav combo or scout phract or phract cav. in scout cav combo.. just keep the number of socuts equal to twice the ats.

good attempt but keeping it simple always helps :-)

Regards
kissi
DeathInc S137

[DeadlySinners]

Range units target AT first, then other range based on total attack, then melee unit by speed (not cumulative attack, not distance, not range). This is why scouts layer for cavs in cav smacks, and why warrior bombs and rams can be layered by faster troops.

Melee units target closest units first, with ties broken by total attack.


http://battle89.evony.com/default.html?logfile/20100401/28/39/2839ad32534b5a7c036635222225fe19.xml

This link should still work.

[Viceicarious]

ok New finding in our research...For each troop who is attacking..the unit they target is determined by: THE UNIT WITH HIGHEST CUM. ATK. WITHIN THE ATTACKING TROOP TYPE'S MOVEMENT SPEED+ ATTACK RANGE. Meaning If, and this is all hypothetical, cavalry have 1000 speed and 500 range...so any unit WITHIN 1500 paces of this cavalry is succeptable to attack. However, the cavalry target the unit inside this range which has the highest cumulative attack. On a side note If there are 2001 pikemen they have 300,150 attack total and there are 3000 swordsmen (300,000) attack if 1000 cavalry attack these units, the target the pikemen first and say they kill 570 pike in first round and say only 300 cavalry survive...the pikemen attack value has then dropped below the attack value of the swordsmen making them the next target for the cavalry in round 2 where they will attack until dead, or until the next round where a new target is chosen.

[tlowe1984]

Actually, no, you are completely wrong on this one. battle89.evony.com/default.html?logfile/20100415/91/36/91360e4741d4d0aa8b99a1ca096f4b11.xml this is a typical lvl 10 npc attack. if the scouts attack FIRST and they target the HIGHEST CUMULATIVE ATTACK TOTAL, then why didn't 400k warriors kill all 2k scouts? 2k scouts vs 400k warriors and according to your methodology, not only did the scouts win and not only did the warriors not kill every one of them, but they also came back in rd 2 and targeted the archer towers, killed them as well and STILL didn't completely die off considering that by this point in time none of my attacking troops other than scouts were in range to attack the warriors and the at's. WOW, THAT'S AMAZING. i think everyone needs to reformulate their npc attack strategies to conform to Vice's rule on scout combat mechanics.

[Naems]

And fastest units move first, with ties to defense.

Defending scouts dont move. Attacking scouts only move when everything else is dead. Not 100% sure how transporters work, but its similar to scouts.

[Viceicarious]

And fastest units move first, with ties to defense.

Defending scouts dont move. Attacking scouts only move when everything else is dead. Not 100% sure how transporters work, but its similar to scouts.

Attacking scouts move first and foremost, if you dont believe me explain this


All scouts die although I come away with victory...
Scouts Attack 1st, and attack unit with highest cum atk, that is within movement speed+attack range. Since scouts are so fast, they reach walls in round 1 and attack strongest unit inside gates, regardless.