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Thread: Frustrated beyond belief

  1. #31

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    Quote Originally Posted by MG95 View Post
    I know it's not my computer. With 8 gigs of RAM, 4 times 4 Ghz of proc and the latest drivers, Win7 64, two vid cardsof each 256 MB ram and about 5 TB of space with all the latest firmwares and so on, I don't think the problem is with my hardware.
    Well there's a few potential problems. Personally I would look on my machine, but for another slant, read below.

    Quote Originally Posted by MG95 View Post
    Right now server 144 has been down yet again for nearly an hour.
    I think you'll get a lot more help if you stop saying things that aren't true. s144 is simply not down when you say it is for two reasons: (1) there would be quite a few more threads than just yours; and (2) I've been in it during the times you claim it's down without issue. So, let's eliminate the server being down a potential problem.

    Here's something that might be part of your issue (might): Evony's hosting service peers with several providers:
    ASN Name
    174 COGENT-PSI-1
    2828 XO-AS15
    3356 LEVEL3
    6130 AIS-WEST
    6939 HURRICANE
    9002 RETN-AS
    19151WVFIBER-1

    Their mix seems to heavily favor XO and Cogent. XO has had several peering disputes with large broadband operators (Comcast and TW being the largest). Cogent has had peering disputes with pretty much everyone on the planet. All of these disputes centered around the fact that XO and Cogent are host-heavy, so their traffic tends to be mostly outbound to their peering partners. As a result of these peering disputes, they both have really weird peering agreements and they both have lots of legacy rate limits hanging around with their peering partners that weren't correct when their peering disputes ended. This sometimes means that a connection to something hosted by an XO customer will work fine from your office, but when you try from your house between 7pm and 10pm you can't connect. Since there is still a rate limit from some long resolved fight between XO and someone upstream of your provider, traffic is sent to that peering connection but drops because the rate limit is fully saturated. This issue also might mean that 10 comcast connections in your area don't work or it works fine for 2hrs and then fails for 30mins over and over throughout the day.

    Like I said, this might not be your problem, but I've personally worked on thousands of issues just like this and they are a dog to track down and resolve. Sometimes it is someone upstream of the host that has to isolate the issue. Sometimes it is someone upstream of the end user's connection.

    Nevertheless, though, there are a million and one variables between you and evony. Add to that the fact that there could be something on your system....some obscure Windows 7 file that got horked in the last update maybe....that could be causing the issue. Nonetheless, despite all these thousands of "could be" issues, we can safely say that:

    1.) Evony's servers are not down dozens of time a day; and
    2.) There is no magic button at Evony that will fix this issue for you. There's a 99% chance that there's nothing Evony can do locally that will even help.

    One thing I might recommend would be to first try and run a ping (say 500 samples) when the connection is working. Later on, when you connection fails, try that ping again. Once you have your ping data, run a traceroute to s144.evony.com. Keep doing that while the connection is failing and look for a dropped packet or a big amount of latency between hops. If you can isolate that, you'll know where you are having problems and can direct that information to your provider.

    Anyway, good luck with your issue.

  2. #32

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    Quote Originally Posted by TAMU View Post
    I think you'll get a lot more help if you stop saying things that aren't true. s144 is simply not down when you say it is for two reasons: (1) there would be quite a few more threads than just yours; and (2) I've been in it during the times you claim it's down without issue. So, let's eliminate the server being down a potential problem.
    As I said just 4 posts before this from you, when a specific customer can't sign on, to them it is "down" or has "crashed". When in the troubleshooting business, sometimes if one gets constantly hung up on exacting precision in regards to how issues are phrased, the customer's issue might be misdiagnosed or misunderstood.

    Example: Years ago, this A+ Certified tech was all confused about how a customer said that they were having problems "downloading" software to their computer. The tech had been working the issue over the phone, and the customer had just dropped off their computer for repair. The tech looked at the modem and did all kinds of tests, and everything was fine. Since I was the escalation contact, I got in touch with the customer, also over the phone. I asked some questions, such as "how are you attempting to download"? She started mentioning putting the CD in the drive.... DOH!

    Solution: Replace CD-ROM drive, as it was defective.

    This sometimes means that a connection to something hosted by an XO customer will work fine from your office, but when you try from your house between 7pm and 10pm you can't connect. Since there is still a rate limit from some long resolved fight between XO and someone upstream of your provider, traffic is sent to that peering connection but drops because the rate limit is fully saturated. This issue also might mean that 10 comcast connections in your area don't work or it works fine for 2hrs and then fails for 30mins over and over throughout the day.
    That's one possible scenario. Assuming that this is the scenario of the moment, there's still one overriding fact:

    Evony's customers cannot address that kind of issue.

    Why? Because most, if not all, of the issues crop up on the FAR END of the communication, closer towards EVONY. In that case, it has already left the exchange point between the local ISP of the customer and has gone on to a large provider, or even so far as the exchange point / demarcation point to Evony's ISP/Hosting colo company. The party that has to take the initiative in that kind of situation is EVONY. I can't just ring up the NOC of XO, Level 3, or Cogent and intercede on Evony's behalf. Why? I don't have a customer agreement with any of them. Evony, however, does have a customer agreement with one of them, which can then in turn contact the other.

    Evony's major issue is that they don't appear to understand this, and thus everything is "black and white", meaning it's either the customer's computer or their login or game servers. When they can demonstrate that the login and/or game servers are up, then all blame is assigned to the customer. The entirety of the other variables between Evony and Evony's customer(s) seems to be totally ignored.

    So, if a customer stating that Evony's servers are messed up is a misdiagnosis due to the other variables inbetween not being considered, then by that same token, isn't Evony's position that a customer's computer is messed up also potentially a misdiagnosis due to lack of consideration of the same variables?


    Like I said, this might not be your problem, but I've personally worked on thousands of issues just like this and they are a dog to track down and resolve. Sometimes it is someone upstream of the host that has to isolate the issue. Sometimes it is someone upstream of the end user's connection.
    From what I've seen, when trying to help others that have these problems, is that the person having a problem can authenticate, but then they cannot reach the game servers. They *CAN* however reach the game server(s) many times by using a proxy server, which means a different route to the servers. This is also not a customer problem, and is something that Evony has to take the responsibility for attempting to figure out what's wrong.

    Example drawing below based on an actual customer's problem ("Cane"). Note that he was able to authenticate, but not play, unless he used a proxy:



    This kind of situation is NOT a problem with a customer's computer, because if it were, switching to a proxy would not have solved the issue. Something is wonky from the game servers back through the internal LAN, and possibly back up as far as Evony's ISP. In any case, nothing a customer can do about it, and blaming the customer will never fix it.

    This, among other reasons, such as my health, are why I can't deal with this game/company anymore...
    Last edited by neko_lord; 08-16-2010 at 01:23 PM.

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    Location
    Buffalo, NY
    Posts
    554

    Default Clearing flash Objects

    This is normally the problem. As posted by Dawnseeker:
    Clearing Evony Flash Files
    Open this path:
    C:\Users\Username\AppData\Roaming\Macromedia\Flash Player\
    *NOTE: Username should be changed to whatever your username is when you log in. The easiest way to get there is to just open My Computer and click on users and then choose the file for your username.
    Once you are there, select the folder called #SharedObjects (you will not be able to see this folder if you can't see hidden files).
    Open the #SharedObjects folder and delete all the files and folders which come up.
    Return to this path: C:\Users\Username\AppData\Roaming\Macromedia\Flash Player\
    Go down to: C:\Users\Username\AppData\Roaming\Macromedia\Flash Player\macromedia.com\support\flashplayer\sys
    Once again, delete all the files and folders except do not delete the Settings folder. Deleting it won't cause any harm, but it will erase your saved Flash settings.
    Clear your cache.
    Restart your computer
    If you follow these steps this should force your computer to download the latest flash client and you should not run into connection problems caused by incompatible clients. Than

    * It can be done easier in Chrome this way:*
    For chrome, go to Tools > Options> Clear Browser>Adobe Flash Storage settings. Choose to delete all saved flash objects. Also make sure Adobe flash is the newest version from their website. Reboot.

  4. #34

    Default When the scripted answers fail

    That's the most troublesome point, is when the scripted responses fail to solve the issue.

    Clearing cache, cookies, flash objects, etc...are only good for certain things, all of which are local computer problems. They cannot and will not ever address a problem with connectivity that is beyond a customer's modem or router. These include problems with Evony's game servers, network infrastructure, login servers, hosting partner(s), hosting partner(s)' ISP(s), or the Internet cloud in general.

    What I see time after time in these more difficult cases is what I described to TAMU, a sense of the customer laying all blame upon Evony, Evony telling them that their servers are working, then Evony laying all blame back on the customer. The points inbetween seem to not be examined, either at all, or thoroughly enough.

    That's where I get frustrated, and certain people see it as me "having all the answers", when in fact I don't, but I'm willing to ask more questions to try to find the answers. Tossing blame around doesn't solve problems. Looking at things logically solves problems.

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Bath, Maine U.S.A.
    Posts
    255

    Default

    OP,

    Have you tried contacting your ISP and sitting down with them explaining what is going on? Have the tech guy read the thread too so he/she can see what you have tried and what has been suggested?

    Maybe your ISP is doing something or their system does not like the evony system. I admith that half of what I read made my curl up in my pink faux fur chair and look cross eyed at the screen. But maybe they can watch your connection or something. Would not hurt to try if nothing else is working.
    Kaiya
    Academy1 Host
    NA13 Only "Shuriken"
    http://bbs.evony.com/group.php?groupid=1596

  6. #36

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    @Tamu:

    First of all, I would appreciate it if you didn't call me a liar or ignorant. Thanks.

    Secondly, I work long enough for MS to know which updates are useful and which are not, also which updates may cause any issue.

    Thirdly, it's a bleeding ONLINE game. This means the ONLY reasons problems like this can occur is a) due to your servers or b) due to a cripple Inet connection. Since I have this problem ONLY with Evony (it does work reasonably at times, but then it starts to go down again 20 times a day - this rules out any blockades by my ISP), it makes sense that the problem lies with you guys.

    Fourthly, Evony is a FLASH game, any vid card of 16MB or over should be freakingly able to play the crap, so what the heck are you talking about with "potential problems with my vidcards"? Again, it's an ONLINE game, which doesn't have too complicated graphics anyway, so it's NOT my machine. Heck, I played Unreal Tournament on this very same configuration not that long ago without any problem or glitch.

    Evony is the only online game that gives me these issues. Any other game I do online has none of such. I checked this while Evony being down on me again by logging in to other games which worked perfectly. The rest of the sites were neither a problem. Only Evony.

    I already had contacted my ISP with regards to this, but they say they are not blocking anything, which makes sense as I am able to get on the server sometimes. Clearing the Flash Objects is sth that I have done already many times before and never fixes the issue, neither does clearing the temp files.

    Now, I understand that the problem clearly is with me and not with Evony. Even when my machine is in perfect shape and my ISP is not blocking Evony, Flash Objects have all gone as are all the Cookies, Temp Files and Temp Inet files, it's still not Evony, it's still me.

    Furthermore, I was a paying customer and being this, I can expect a decent working service which it hasn't been more often than it has been so far. So, what could be such a big deal with a Flashgame, which isn't that supercomplicated that it requires massive resources from your computer, that just doesn't want to run normally. What causes it to have such an enormous downtime - yes, enormous, as I at times get the choice of a) being kicked off after 3 actions performed too quick and the server cannot cope with the speed of it, or b) being simply kicked off after 20 to 30 minutes. It doesn't always do this, but more and more frequently, even more than it used to do.

    Sorry for the harsh tone, but as a paying customer I just don't like to be called a liar or being ignorant, thank you.

  7. #37

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    Quote Originally Posted by lordgonzo View Post
    Do you know what frustrates me ?


    You crying to the forums when you should post a ticket , wait 7 days then Email DawnSeeker , wait 7 days then Private message DawnSeeker Then wait 7 days THEN post a a useless annoying thread

    If you dont like the game or customer service , then dont play it , simple.
    hahahhahahahahahaha

    omg that was awesome. If that is really the CS method Evony setup then we are all doomed.

    He posted a ticket. Proper companies respond within 24 hours. The online games i play with proper CS departments replied to me in 40 minutes. Waiting 3 weeks... really? So you expect his cities to stand around for 3 weeks without being able to build, defend or farm and for him to be happyface about it? You are funny.

  8. #38

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    Quote Originally Posted by neko_lord View Post
    That's the most troublesome point, is when the scripted responses fail to solve the issue.

    Clearing cache, cookies, flash objects, etc...are only good for certain things, all of which are local computer problems. They cannot and will not ever address a problem with connectivity that is beyond a customer's modem or router. These include problems with Evony's game servers, network infrastructure, login servers, hosting partner(s), hosting partner(s)' ISP(s), or the Internet cloud in general.
    As an example my ISP bought a bunch of IP's from Europe and assigned them to US customers. End result is a conflict causing many of us not to be able to connect (or be rejected from connecting) to many sites, EVONY being one of them. Thankfully on my part my air card pulls a fully working IP and so I can connect to Evony (and here) through it. We have a thread going on with the Company's customer care site and it echos a lot of what you are saying.
    Lady Amikee
    Retired-Just Observing Now

  9. #39

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    Quote Originally Posted by Amikee View Post
    As an example my ISP bought a bunch of IP's from Europe and assigned them to US customers. End result is a conflict causing many of us not to be able to connect (or be rejected from connecting) to many sites, EVONY being one of them. Thankfully on my part my air card pulls a fully working IP and so I can connect to Evony (and here) through it. We have a thread going on with the Company's customer care site and it echos a lot of what you are saying.
    The problem is that many people consider the cache and cookies thing to be a "cure-all". Sure, it does correct some issues, but it most certainly cannot possibly correct all issues, particularly if they are being caused by a situation external to the customer's premises (CPE is the industry TLA - Customer Premises Equipment). This sets up the scenario when it doesn't "cure" a problem that is beyond the scope of what it could possibly address, that's the end of the troubleshooting script. The next step in many cases is to simply put all the "blame" on the customer or the customer's equipment. This leads to more anger / resentment between the customer and the company, particularly if there is money involved, and increasing with the amount of "lock in" with respect to that money - ISPs or cell phone carriers, for example...

  10. #40

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    Since I no longer work for Evony, I am finally free to say what I have wanted to say forever and ever.

    First of all, Tamu is trying his best to be helpful and to point out that the problem is not on the Evony server side. Flaming him for it is despicable at best and shows a distinct lack of character.

    Second, you really need to use a bit of logic here. If we have thousands of players online, and they are all connected to the server, it is not \"down\". Don\'t give me that \"it\'s down for him\" garbage, please. A server being down means that it is not currently operating, online, and available for login. The server isn\'t down if you are the only person who can\'t get onto it.

    Evony isn\'t Apple, or Microsoft, or Emachines or HP or Dell. They aren\'t your ISP. They aren\'t the \"Geek Squad\" who comes out to your house to fix your computer problems. They can offer some general assistance to help you get connected to the game, but it isn\'t feasible or reasonable or even possible to provide in-depth diagnostics and support to the people who can\'t make things work. They aren\'t in the computer support business...they are in the business of creating and running a game. That\'s it.

    While I know the tech team and customer service all have sympathy for those who have issues like this, and they\'d love to help, their options are extremely limited. The problem isn\'t at Evony. I don\'t know where it is, but 1000\'s of people aren\'t magically finding a way around the servers being \'down\'.

    Your computer was able to access it previously if you played and spent before this. So here\'s your clue: Figure out what changed. SOMETHING did. I\'m sorry for your frustration, but we\'ve all gone through it with one game or another at times, or with some piece of software, and eventually you need to either take the responsibility for fixing this yourself or shrug and move on.


    Thank you, Ravenwings, for my new siggie! WOOT!

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