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Thread: Defending Atlantis (post drafting change)

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  1. #1

    Default Defending Atlantis (post drafting change)

    I'm going to lay out the difficulties / impossibility of defending atlantis and how it is exasperated with being unable to draft from HC's anymore.

    Atlantis will need a compact defense style. All kinds of random people can send 1k warrior attacks to constantly hit the city. In no other city do you need to worry about this, but in Atlantis you do. No one can spend all day at their computer queuing up 1 trap every 10 seconds.

    Compact defense cities rely on archer towers to absorb archer fire leaving the city's archers untouched. After 12 hours the first waves will start to hit. Maybe you'll have 4k archer towers which will easily be powered through by the other players who were building up to take Atlantis before you beat them to it.

    I'm guessing Atlantis will be taken by a group of 6 players starting with 10M archers each and ending with 5M archers each. This leaves the player who owns it with 5M archers and with a lvl 10 embassy 1.5Mish reinforcements. After the towers are powered through new archer waves will trade fire with defending archers with a 1:1 kill rate so it will only take 7M or so archers to break.

    But defender will not have enough swordsmen for a proper compact defense so his archers will be scout bombed. Tons of warriors could serve this function but w/o drafting from HC's the defender won't have enough.

    The defender will have no way to drop enough honor and will constantly have a 10% heal rate while the aggressors will have a 50% heal rate.

    I guess the extra warrior drafting may not make all that much of a difference with defending Atlantis but it would at least be worth something and could block scout bombs. Stockpiling speech texts from fb may be the best defense.

    I have three suggestions for the devs on how to help with this.

    1) Have Atlantis' traps and archer towers and whatnot regenerate like they do on an npc.
    2) Have Atlantis' embassy be much more capable.
    3) Give Atlantis an increased heal rate.

    Is it really this dire? Maybe a little discussion?

  2. #2

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    tl;dr summary.

    1) You'll be forced into a compact defense.

    2) You won't have the proper troop types for a compact defense and compact defense defenses are never cost free.

  3. #3
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    A strong player can pack Atlantis or ANY Historical with millions of troops, use strategems, etc... I am just going to make a wild guess here.... but the player who ultimately captures Atlantis will be a big spender. Why? Because you will need lots of strategems and other goodies in order to help you defend it. That being said, in Age II have you ever tried to attack a NORMAL city of a big spender who really knows what they are doing? It is extremely hard. I have seen alliances send over 10 million archers PLUS other troops to a top player on our server. And that player lost almost nothing.

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  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by japanpimp View Post
    A strong player can pack Atlantis or ANY Historical with millions of troops, use strategems, etc... I am just going to make a wild guess here.... but the player who ultimately captures Atlantis will be a big spender. Why? Because you will need lots of strategems and other goodies in order to help you defend it. That being said, in Age II have you ever tried to attack a NORMAL city of a big spender who really knows what they are doing? It is extremely hard. I have seen alliances send over 10 million archers PLUS other troops to a top player on our server. And that player lost almost nothing.
    Oh ya as long as I can keep t/a/d up and reinforce I could defend any of my cities vs 10M archers with only losing 1 pike 1 sword 1 war & 1 worker each attack. I could take 10 hours of my day putting up one trap every 10 seconds and using a strategem on the attacks landing in the same second.

    If you add another 200 people sending waves of 200 warriors 5 cav and 5 archers though keeping t/a/d up will be unlikely. Especially if it's around the clock. Attacks hitting in the same second will occur by accident and frequently. Good players will easily manage 80 attacks landing in the same second.

    Your 'reports' enemy page will be unreadable.

    If you plan on reinforcing layers from nearby city it will be hit with beseige right before 1M archers land. Or someone will use Thunder Raid 10 secs before their attack lands and you had reinforcements timed to get there 1 sec before attack. The defender will have a ton of stragegems, but so do lots of people.

    Basically the person you mention probably had t/a/d up the whole time. I don't think that will be possible with Atlantis.

    But then again If Atlantis is only drafting 10 cities for 5% a day maybe ppl just wont care. Get rid of drafting altogether and Atlantis might be a lot better off...

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pepperpot99 View Post
    Oh ya as long as I can keep t/a/d up and reinforce I could defend any of my cities vs 10M archers with only losing 1 pike 1 sword 1 war & 1 worker each attack. I could take 10 hours of my day putting up one trap every 10 seconds and using a strategem on the attacks landing in the same second.

    If you add another 200 people sending waves of 200 warriors 5 cav and 5 archers though keeping t/a/d up will be unlikely. Especially if it's around the clock. Attacks hitting in the same second will occur by accident and frequently. Good players will easily manage 80 attacks landing in the same second.

    Your 'reports' enemy page will be unreadable.

    If you plan on reinforcing layers from nearby city it will be hit with beseige right before 1M archers land. Or someone will use Thunder Raid 10 secs before their attack lands and you had reinforcements timed to get there 1 sec before attack. The defender will have a ton of stragegems, but so do lots of people.

    Basically the person you mention probably had t/a/d up the whole time. I don't think that will be possible with Atlantis.

    But then again If Atlantis is only drafting 10 cities for 5% a day maybe ppl just wont care. Get rid of drafting altogether and Atlantis might be a lot better off...
    Japanpimp has no idea how to defend his city's, so why he would have anything to say about defending 0,0 is mind-boggling. Just keep in mind most of what JP says is only to mess with you, i'm pretty sure JP has no idea what your talking about when you say 0,0 need to be in CD, notice he doesn't mention anything about CD, or 5k setup, he just says "they'll have millions of troops, and strategem", but he has no idea what it takes to keep 5k setup going, and what happens to those 10 million archers if you lose your 5k.
    Last edited by Swesal; 08-20-2010 at 10:09 PM.

  6. #6

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    Just an update for you. Fear has taken Atlantis in Na9 a few hours ago.

  7. #7
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    Just give atlantis to another member every 24 hours, problem solved.

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Woldere View Post
    Just give atlantis to another member every 24 hours, problem solved.
    HAH, aren't we in a good mood today Woldere! :-P

    Atlantis has not been taken yet. So, rather then asking about defending it, ask how to take it without the additional support needed from drafting in your 12s, 14s, and 16s.

    -Dunko

  9. #9

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    Quote Originally Posted by Woldere View Post
    Just give atlantis to another member every 24 hours, problem solved.
    That will work a couple times, but if you keep it at zero loyalty with no troops someone else is likely to get in there before your partner before too many handoffs. Even if you owned the city 1 mile away and were sending ponies and I was 100 miles away I could put a 24 hour camp time on 80 attacks. This would make your next handoff fairly risky.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pepperpot99 View Post
    I'm going to lay out the difficulties / impossibility of defending atlantis and how it is exasperated with being unable to draft from HC's anymore.

    Atlantis will need a compact defense style. All kinds of random people can send 1k warrior attacks to constantly hit the city. In no other city do you need to worry about this, but in Atlantis you do. No one can spend all day at their computer queuing up 1 trap every 10 seconds.

    Compact defense cities rely on archer towers to absorb archer fire leaving the city's archers untouched. After 12 hours the first waves will start to hit. Maybe you'll have 4k archer towers which will easily be powered through by the other players who were building up to take Atlantis before you beat them to it.

    I'm guessing Atlantis will be taken by a group of 6 players starting with 10M archers each and ending with 5M archers each. This leaves the player who owns it with 5M archers and with a lvl 10 embassy 1.5Mish reinforcements. After the towers are powered through new archer waves will trade fire with defending archers with a 1:1 kill rate so it will only take 7M or so archers to break.

    But defender will not have enough swordsmen for a proper compact defense so his archers will be scout bombed. Tons of warriors could serve this function but w/o drafting from HC's the defender won't have enough.

    The defender will have no way to drop enough honor and will constantly have a 10% heal rate while the aggressors will have a 50% heal rate.

    I guess the extra warrior drafting may not make all that much of a difference with defending Atlantis but it would at least be worth something and could block scout bombs. Stockpiling speech texts from fb may be the best defense.

    I have three suggestions for the devs on how to help with this.

    1) Have Atlantis' traps and archer towers and whatnot regenerate like they do on an npc.
    2) Have Atlantis' embassy be much more capable.
    3) Give Atlantis an increased heal rate.

    Is it really this dire? Maybe a little discussion?
    As woldere has said:

    "brool cory sto!"

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