The substance of space

[Rota]

I was pondering the composition of the universe tonight. I was pondering a great ponder on the subject of dark matter, and what it is. What is it it made out of? I began to think about water and fish.

Fish live in water, it is the "atmosphere" they dwell in. We live in air, that is the atmosphere that humans dwell in. To a fish, the water level is the ceiling to their atmosphere. Beyond it, is some unknown environment and certain death. To a human, the exosphere is the outermost layer of "air," and thus is the ceiling to our atmosphere. Beyond it, is some unknown environment and certain death.

So, fish is to water, as human is to air.
We don't really perceive air in a tangible sense, because we exist in it's constant presence. I would guess that fish don't really perceive water in a tangible sense, because they exist in it's constant presence. Basically, fish "fly" through the atmosphere of their world.

To a fish, they have no clue what air is, because they have no technology. They only know that air is "the great beyond" that is utterly fatal. We never even knew that the air was "something" until recently. We knew we needed it to breathe, and thus live. But, we did not know that air was full of oxygen molecules and various other gases, and that was what we needed to breathe. As far as we knew, the air was "nothing" at all. We have only recently gained the technology to perceive that the air is made of molecules. We only know that space is "the great beyond" that is utterly fatal. We call it a vacuum, and that's true because there is no air pressure. We call it a void, but that may not be true.

Just because there is no air does not that mean it's "nothing" and empty. What if there is "something" that makes up space, just like various gas molecules make up the air? We might simply not have the technology to perceive the substance that makes fills the emptiness of space. One day, we will know that space is made of "_?_?_?_?_?_" just like the day we learned about oxygen molecules.


So here is the discussion:
Do you think space is truly nothing? Are the area between the planets and stars a complete void?
Is space made of something? Just as fish have their atmosphere of water, and we have our atmosphere of air, space is an atmosphere of _?_?_?_?_?_.
I'm not talking about gas clouds or nebulas or objects in space, I know those are "something" for sure. They can be tangibly seen and measured. I'm talking about the vast "nothingness" between all those landmarks.

What theoretical particle might be the substance of space? What would it's properties be?



Side discussion:
We have all these fancy machines that defy gravity by fighting it with propulsion. Fish defy gravity and fly around like superman, simply by being buoyant in their atmosphere. We have hot air balloons that do the same, but they are HUGE, and cumbersome.

Is it possible to become buoyant in air. I don't mean a hot air balloon, I mean like a personal device that affects us the air around us, and thus allows flight like superman? Maybe utilizing the particles of space, we could create something.
If a fish can do it, then so can we.


P.S. I rambled quite a bit there. If anything needs clarification, please let me know.

[Balaam]

first... i really do love the way you think!

IMO
space is a void, the closer you are to an object the more cluttered the void becomes due to the gravity surrounding that object

so even at the bottom of the sea on earth there is still a void, it is so cluttered with atoms... it seems full (of water) however, even the water has voids, each molecule has space within it

in the depths of outer space the void is far less cluttered

[rasterbee]

This guy can go days without water, breathing air through it's skin.


^mudskipper

Maybe someday we'll be able absorb space through our skin.

[Bree Fletcher]

So here is the discussion:
Do you think space is truly nothing? Are the area between the planets and stars a complete void?
Is space made of something? Just as fish have their atmosphere of water, and we have our atmosphere of air, space is an atmosphere of _?_?_?_?_?_.

I was always under the impression that space was a super-thin amount of hydrogen, of a density like one molecule per cubic centimeter, or something equally crazy-low. Just as our atmosphere is less dense than the fish's "atmosphere" or water, so is there space that's the same matter, but much less dense than our own atmosphere.

[Mismaah]

I think space contains of something which is not air but something that we haven't discovered yet.

This week, the science teacher explained about the radiation from the Sun but I was wondering how the heat travels when there is no air or anything in space for the heat to travel from the Sun to Earth.

So I guess we might find out what that "something" someday....

[Bree Fletcher]

This week, the science teacher explained about the radiation from the Sun but I was wondering how the heat travels when there is no air or anything in space for the heat to travel from the Sun to Earth.

Photons. Nothing mysterious, they've been discovered already.

[Mismaah]

wtf? the teacher didn't tell me that >.>

[rasterbee]

I was always under the impression that space was a super-thin amount of hydrogen, of a density like one molecule per cubic centimeter, or something equally crazy-low.

I had never heard that before, so I had to go check it out.

Wikipedia says "a few H atoms per cubic meter."

Outer space is the closest natural approximation of a perfect vacuum. It has effectively no friction, allowing stars, planets and moons to move freely along ideal gravitational trajectories. However, even in the deep vacuum of intergalactic space there are still a few hydrogen atoms per cubic meter.[18] By comparison, the air we breathe contains about 10^25 molecules per cubic meter.[19] The sparse density of matter in outer space means that electromagnetic radiation can travel great distances without being scattered; the mean free path for a photon in intergalactic space is about 10^23 km, or 10 billion light years.[20] The deep vacuum of space could make it an attractive environment for certain industrial processes, for instance those that require ultraclean surfaces.[21]

[Starr Spark]

Space is just that--the void, or the distance between objects. It's the lack of something, rather than the presence of some unknown quantity.

They've already determined that there is little bits of stuff in space. It's all about the density of bits in one spot.

Fish breathe water and humans breathe air, but there has to be the right concentration of bits for both. The higher you go in our atmosphere, the less dense the oxygen concentration becomes, so it becomes harder and harder for humans to breathe. Fish are different from each other, in that some need particular densities of water and salt in the ocean--one that lives near the surface may not live 1000 ft. below the surface, and vice versa--or, no salt at all.

Fish do not "fly" through their atmosphere simply because they are less dense than water--it's also because they have a biological means of propulsion that utilizes the concentrations of their "atmosphere"--their fins push against the water, or they can take water in and shoot it out in one direction. Humans are denser than air, and thus do not float. We also have no biological means of propulsion other than are limbs, which are good for pushing us along a dense enough matter, like the ground or water, but cannot "grab" air, like bird wings. We need a mechanical means of propulsion. Jet packs, anyone?

That said, there very well may be some creature out there that could live out in the middle of space, as long as it doesn't need high concentrations of particular bits, and I guess if it can survive space radiation.

[XxflamesxX]

So here is the discussion:
Do you think space is truly nothing? Are the area between the planets and stars a complete void?
Is space made of something? Just as fish have their atmosphere of water, and we have our atmosphere of air, space is an atmosphere of _?_?_?_?_?_.
I'm not talking about gas clouds or nebulas or objects in space, I know those are "something" for sure. They can be tangibly seen and measured. I'm talking about the vast "nothingness" between all those landmarks.

What theoretical particle might be the substance of space? What would it's properties be?



Side discussion:
We have all these fancy machines that defy gravity by fighting it with propulsion. Fish defy gravity and fly around like superman, simply by being buoyant in their atmosphere. We have hot air balloons that do the same, but they are HUGE, and cumbersome.

Is it possible to become buoyant in air. I don't mean a hot air balloon, I mean like a personal device that affects us the air around us, and thus allows flight like superman? Maybe utilizing the particles of space, we could create something.
If a fish can do it, then so can we.

I think there is something in Space, It is unlikely not to be Like you said a unknown gas or compound, I cant shed light on what compound it is however, as it is unknown and my brain is just to ickle to try and guess what it could be. Like Air, it will most likely have a makeup of gasses, however we can all guess with much conifdence that the make up is nothing like the compound make up that Air its self has or we would be able to surive in it. If there was nothing there what so ever, Paritcals and such would rush to fill the empty gap.

I think of it as a glass in the water, upend a glas thats in water and slowly take it out and you will notice that the water level inside of the glass is much higher then the level of the water in the container/bowl/puddle/toilet (what ever you chose to run this test in!) but as soon as you break the air lock, the water drops and Air which has a lesser density rushes to fill the gap made.
So something must be filling the space in ... space. imo.

Fish do not "fly" through their atmosphere simply because they are less dense than water--it's also because they have a biological means of propulsion that utilizes the concentrations of their "atmosphere"--their fins push against the water, or they can take water in and shoot it out in one direction.Humans are denser than air, and thus do not float. We also have no biological means of propulsion other than are limbs, which are good for pushing us along a dense enough matter, like the ground or water, but cannot "grab" air, like bird wings. We need a mechanical means of propulsion.

Techinally, Some fish Do Fly through water, the motions that their body makes mimic a bird, Its like saying penguins dont fly... They do, just under water.
You are correct in saying about the density however as I think the way Rota ment fish 'fly' is the point you were trying to combat.
Its not that fish are less dense then water, as they are not, Its just as a mass water can support them. Our air cannot support our weight.
Birds are denser then Air, yet can still fly. They have the body shape and the power in the wings to propell themselfs and cause air currents to keep them aloft. Also their bones are thin to cut down on weight.
A bumblebee should not be able to fly, from an engerining point of few it is IMPOSSIBLE that a bumble can get airborn let alone fly. Their body is the wrong shape, size, proportions. And up until recently no one knew how they did it, it wasnt until they were able to flim them in such slow motion they could watch the wing movements lost to a normal eye it is so fast. [Try and watch a BBC program called Invisable world - I think its the speed editon]

That said, there very well may be some creature out there that could live out in the middle of space, as long as it doesn't need high concentrations of particular bits, and I guess if it can survive space radiation.

A Creature could only live in Space if their was food or water to live on, both of which cannot be provided in space. There maybe a creature [like a cockroach as they can survive a nuclear bomb] which could surive in the 'Air' makeup of space, but without the food an water elements we may never be able to test this. Plants and such life need our plannets air so wouldnt be able to provide a food source.

I feel like ive gotten of topic... umm... sorry about that...