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Thread: February 11: Troop and Hero Bug Fixes

  1. #1501

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    Quoting out of order, because I think this part is important to approach first, given the length.

    Quote Originally Posted by SoUlSS55 View Post
    however i will say this...

    when i log onto evony one of the first things i see in the top banner is ' NO cheats'... therefore by definition any method of travel/attacking etc etc is a viable way of operating not a cheat...
    Yeah, that is a literal translation of what you're seeing, unfortunately you didn't include all of what it says, and as such I believe that you've interpreted it incorrectly. Based on the way in which you've been typing, I am not sure that English is your native language. Is that true?

    What it says is:

    "There are NO CHEATS in game. In case of any account will be closed instantly."

    The second sentence is what you've left off. Those two sentences combined really mean this:

    "Do not ask other players if there are cheats in this game, as there aren't any. In the event that we missed something and there is a cheat in the game, people that use the cheat will have their accounts closed instantly."

    I know people will kick and scream and say "THAT'S NOT WHAT IT SAYS!". No, it isn't, but the problem is that the text was likely written by someone in China that was also working with a language barrier. "THAT'S NOT MY PROBLEM!!!" No, I guess not specifically, but this is where, again, the whole "rational person" / "common sense" thing comes into play.


    1stly though i have followed your posts you haven't followed mine... i said the free food and quick march should go and stay gone, many times... so calling my integrity into question shows your inabilty to read what me and others have said...
    There has been some waivering in your posts, particularly in regards to the costs. Also, I don't think people understand that reducing costs is not just going to help them.

    In the jobs that I have had in the past 12 years, a key requirement is root cause analysis.

    Making mechs cost less to move and march faster (even if you don't want this, most others that I'm disagreeing with do) has a ripple effect. This means that it will be made easier for everyone.

    Multi-accounters, botters, and account sharers all want to win for reduced effort. The game is what the game is. If you feel the game would be better if it was changed, then bringing up change requests is perfectly fine to do. The problem is, multi-accounting, botting, and account sharing is pretty much also accepted as "normal", just like people claimed that this issue was considered "normal".

    What's going to happen, without a change of direction, is that more people will resort to multi-accounting, botting, and account sharing, because they feel relatively sure that the company isn't going to do anything about it.

    So, if the company does nothing about those three things right now, first, before doing anything else, the notion of those three things being "normal" will take hold even more.

    Now, let's say that down the road, maybe in 3-4 months, the company unveils this plan to get rid of multi-accounters and account sharing by use of tracking IP addresses, which is one thing that they could possibly use for tracking.

    What will happen is people will complain that the company didn't do anything for so long and this was the only way that they could "level the playing field" between them and botters, people who spend lots of money, or people with "no lives" that sleep less than they do. They will threaten to quit. Tell Evony where to stick it. Troll the forum with claims that theirs is bigger than someone elses, etc, etc, etc... Basically, a repeat of what's going on now.

    To make the game better, the root cause needs to be addressed. Sure, people can say that the game "takes too long" or whatever. What those people fail to take into consideration is that you have to farm these enormous amounts of food and carry these enormous armies because of all the cheating that goes on. Account-sharing makes it to where it's difficult to impossible to take someone's city away from them. Because you couldn't take their city, they can then rebuild more easily and then return to attack you. Had you been able to remove that city, then they would've had to have started their rebuilding without that city.

    Multi-accounting, allows one person to have larger resource and troop production potential than what they would've had if they had not had the extra cities, not to mention more heroes that they can transfer to their own account.

    Botting, especially if done from an alt account, also leads to increase resource collection and higher hero levels.

    I've said multiple times that I'm not opposed to talking about reductions in cost of moving mechs and even their speed, but what everyone keeps on missing is that I'm interested in holding Evony's feet to the fire about getting rid of the cheating in the game before doing that.


    if your argument is a pult cant travel as fast as a scout... well it dont take 2 ppl to make an archer...
    I can see where it would. One person is the trainer and the other is the recruit. Yes, it would then be unlikely that every single recruit would require a separate trainer.

    Anyway, the way to think about that is it's just another aspect of their production cost. There comes a point where you can nitpick things to the extreme. The key thing here is something that works one way the "standard" way of doing things vs. a very different way if you do some hocus pocus "Hail Mary" (as Dave put it).

    states back then were never an identical size... 100k cav wouldn't kill 300k arhcers with the result being totally different with the placement of 1abt... you couldn't pay to have your market deliver goods instantaniously..blah blah blah. reality doesn't come into it...
    Again, you can nitpick everything to pieces. That approach just leads to a declaration of "anarchy", meaning no rules.

    the fact is it is NOW a cheat if anyone exploits a future bug/glitch/mechanic to enjoy previous benefits before this fix...
    This is your translation of the in-game scroll coming up again. It really always has been claimed to be a "cheat" if you pursue and use a flaw in the game.

    The thing I keep hear being raised up is "what if everything we do they just some day decide that it's an exploit and take it away".

    Trust me, if they did that, there are plenty of us out here that will call them on that, including myself.

    I'll comment on my prior "no comment" about going to work for them. I'd never consider it. I might do contract work as an independent contractor, with the knowledge that I'd need to sign a non-disclosure agreement and a non-compete agreement, but there's the "snowball's chance in the bad place" that they'd ever consider asking.

    I'm only remaining here because it is a decent time-waster, but with the rampant cheating, I've been more and more content to just "be a farmer". Regardless of how people that level that charge against me feel that it makes them superior, it doesn't really bother me, because the computer (the game server) has never actively attempted to cheat me, to the best of my knowledge.
    Last edited by neko_lord; 02-14-2011 at 06:03 PM.

  2. #1502

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    Quote Originally Posted by BigNorr View Post
    I have resigned myself that most people account share and so I will not take your resources or city. In fact if I am after you it means I have taken an NPC beside you and cannot take your city anyway. I don't care if I get your heros, if I get res its nice but its not why I'm there. I'm there for the big kill report and to play a 'war game' all I'm asking is to be able to do that.
    I don't account-share. I never have. It was asked of me and I said no.

    To relate to what you said:

    I'm there for playing a 'war game'. All I'm asking is to be able to do it against someone who isn't account-sharing, botting, or using multiple accounts, just like I'm not account-sharing, botting, or using multiple accounts. In other words, something fair and square.

    The past few days have demonstrated to me that I'll likely never be able to do that.


    *******************

    Edit: To any industrious mod that comes along, please don't combine this with the other lengthy post. The posts are two different streams of thought to two different people, with one being extremely lengthy, and thus it would be rude of me to make one person or the other plow through stuff not intended for them with the length of the other post. I do know about multiquoting, and I've done that over the past few days. It's just sometimes I think multiquoting is rude to the people I'm trying to talk to. Thanks.
    Last edited by neko_lord; 02-14-2011 at 08:19 PM.

  3. #1503

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    Quote Originally Posted by neko_lord View Post
    You can't have an exploit, even rebranded as a normal game mechanic, give you an advantage over a botter, because the botter is just going to use the same advantage as you will be.

    If you folks are hung up about me calling it an exploit, notice I said "normal game mechanic" too. You claim that the exploit gave you a way to attack botters. When it is legalized, it becomes a normal game mechanic. Your assertion is that normal game mechanics OTHER THAN THIS EXPLOIT would not allow you to properly deal with botters. So, once this becomes a normal game mechanic and not an exploit, would not the previous conditions of normal game mechanics not allowing you to properly attack botters then be the prevailing condition of the game?

    If you can speed up your reinforcements to attack them with, that same boost of speed will allow them to reinforce themselves quicker. The playing field is "leveled", but that's the whole point. It's LEVELED. You will not have an advantage over a botter. The *ONLY* people you will have advantages over are people who never knew about this exploit and/or didn't use it, so you have massive troop advantages over them.

    Already there's been one mention of "I don't care, I just want to attack". That kind of attitude shows that people know full well that their juicy targets are not really botters, but are what they consider "noobs" with "puny armies" because they (we) were "too stupid" to "fully explore the game" (aka, find a flaw and exploit it for all it's worth, then demand that it be made legal once you got busted).

    The solution to addressing botters *IS NOT* to bring back the exploit and call it "legal". It is to DEMAND that the company REMOVES THEM FROM THE GAME rather than having this fantasy that you'll be able to remove them "if only" you had the legalized exploit back.

    Instead of DEMANDING some Glitch-a-roni special, the Guangzhou [China] Treat, DEMAND THAT PEOPLE PLAY WITH INTEGRITY. I can, however, see that as being problematic if you lack integrity in the first place.
    spot on!! - I SEE THE LIGHT (not yelling more praising!!)

    These people are using the excuse that these exploits helped deal with botters but the reality is these exploits were only being used against those that DID NOT know about the exploits. As a result giving a massive advantage to those that used it.

  4. #1504

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    Quote Originally Posted by BillyJoe View Post
    you have changed the game so much you guys really messed up here and are gettin ready to loose so many players over this, the fun thing was to be able to hit with these massive mech hits and all you did was take the fun out of the game.

    Very UnHappy Player
    BillyJoe
    Host
    Evolved SS58
    guys it isnt the first time theyve changed **** around and lost players just do what i did quit theres plenty of other games out there trust me

  5. #1505
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    spot on!! - I SEE THE LIGHT (not yelling more praising!!)

    These people are using the excuse that these exploits helped deal with botters but the reality is these exploits were only being used against those that DID NOT know about the exploits. As a result giving a massive advantage to those that used it.
    if they didnt know they need to get out form under there rock alittle more lol
    maybe join a more advanced alliance to teach them the ways for the force

    -Bishop
    Last edited by BishBot; 02-14-2011 at 10:05 PM. Reason: oops :P
    Be a tyrant not a diplomat!

  6. #1506

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    Quote Originally Posted by BishBot View Post
    if they didnt know they need to get out form under there rock alittle more lol
    maybe join a more advanced alliance to teach them the ways for the force

    -Bishop
    yeah for sure - if by get out and join another advanced alliance you mean ones like yours that use exploits. You can have them cause it is your advanced alliance that is screaming how unfair it is to have this change applied.

    Then go for it cheats travel in packs on this game that is the one thing that seems common.

  7. #1507

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    Quote Originally Posted by Morgan le Fay View Post
    Let me see....

    Fixing the glitch when all attackers had to do was send silly amount of troops to get a report-hence the 10% reports.

    Introducing the holiday mode, then adjusting it further so that you can holiday if attacks are incoming.

    Albeit someone needs to pay for them these special holiday buffs for your alliance & your in game friends to help with the troop upkeep.

    Fixing the hero valley trick to prevent these ridiculously high level heroes.

    Introducing super servers so when servers fall to a certain active level they get merged with others so that players keep their accounts and can carry on enjoying themselves.

    Maybe small things but they go some way of improving the game.
    Thank you for showing all of us what you know.
    Clearly, that doesn't amount to very much

    Take a look below (my responses are in blue):

    Morgan le Fay: Fixing the glitch when all attackers had to do was send silly amount of troops to get a report-hence the 10% reports.

    No, this hasn't been fixed.
    Even the most heavily guarded city continues to be transparent.
    I can still get a report by sending a special combination of three different troop types.
    The mix is 500-99-99.


    Morgan le Fay: Introducing the holiday mode, then adjusting it further so that you can holiday if attacks are incoming.

    The first time Holiday mode was introduced, those who paid to use it found themselves stripped of all food when they un-holidayed.
    In short, a screw-up from the start.
    Even now, valleys can be captured from a holidayed player!
    Similarly, in the newer version, a HC can be taken away from a holidayed player!
    This is a bizarre deal when the holidayed player has paid real money to be frozen out of the game for a while.

    The push behind this (as with almost every 'fix' from the guys who are running this game down) is a combination of greed & money.
    Consider the fact that a truced player is safe from any such nonsense.
    Consider also the fact that a half-day Truce costs 30 cents and a day's Holiday costs 10 cents.
    Now you know why they 'fixed' it, eh?


    Morgan le Fay: Albeit someone needs to pay for them these special holiday buffs for your alliance & your in game friends to help with the troop upkeep.

    Two words - GREED & MONEY

    Morgan le Fay: Fixing the hero valley trick to prevent these ridiculously high level heroes.

    No, this hasn't been fixed (although I'm sure some dimwit has already run to Evony to breathlessly let them know it's still happening).
    On ss3x, 18 heroes were transferred without medal-persuasion just yesterday.
    This includes two VERY high heroes.

    Again, this is about greed and money.
    Of course, medals cost real money.
    This is why they stopped NPC hits from resulting in any kind of medals.
    This is also why they reduced the valleys to almost a medal-barren state.

    The target group here for this 'milk-them-for-medals' campaign here is the newcomers, since most players have thousands of medals from the old unmerged servers.


    Morgan le Fay: Introducing super servers so when servers fall to a certain active level they get merged with others so that players keep their accounts and can carry on enjoying themselves.

    You make it sound like a family reunion

    Have you ever been through a merger?
    I have toiled through two so far, and it seems another is on its way.

    And what exactly is this 'certain active level'?

    Right next to one of my cities is a fort that is, has been and will be at 126,380 prestige.
    Everywhere you look, you see thousands of inactives and bot-created villages.
    Are we to believe that Evony's logs don't show who has not logged in for the last umpteen weeks?
    If they were to remove even a tenth of these inactives and fillers, the entire family of servers could very well be merged into one super-server.

    Anyway, they should stop calling it and advertising it as a super-server.
    How is it a super-server when the super-servers are forced to merge again?

    Already, larger maps made it more and more difficult to attack.
    Now that they 'fixed' (I prefer screwed-up) the valley-troop-transfer method, attacking distant targets has become a player's worst nightmare.
    I shudder to think of what an even larger map will do to all this 'activity'.

    I'm all for merging if:
    1. they remove the dead and check again for sufficient space and activity
    2. they allow the merged servers enough time to rebuild NPC farms
    3. they provide notice well in advance to all players about an impending merger

    As for your naive 'carry on enjoying yourselves', bah!


    Morgan le Fay: Maybe small things but they go some way of improving the game.

    If you have noticed any 'improvements' other than screwed-up chat windows, screwed-up march-time displays, screw-up march-food-consumption calculations, please do list them.

    The only regular improvement I see yet is in the renaming of the Free Chests.
    Valentine, Easter, Thanksgiving, New Year, Santa... what next?
    Mickey Mouse?

    As of now, I have enough in stock to seriously hurt an enemy with a rainbowed chest attack.

  8. #1508

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    Let me see if I understand ....

    I write to Evony and say there's a problem, and get back a response in pidgeon English saying, "We no tell you how play game."

    Then someone figures it out and kindly writes an article, and everyone including my dog knows how to combine troops on a valley.

    Then you "fix it" so it doesn't work anymore, and I'm left playing "farmville" because all I can do it *****-slap my neighbour 1 block away.

    I don't play because I win or loose little imaginary armies in virtual battles.
    I play because of the "cleverness" of the solutions I find to problems.
    I play because I can outwit and outplay lamebrain coiners.

    I've invested time in learning this game, and you saying "F... you" for your effort.

    You taking all the fun out.
    You taking the skill out.

  9. #1509

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    Karna.....good one on ya man.

  10. #1510

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    rofl
    Poor DespicableME. He's still mad that no one told him how to move mechs quickly. Still accusing everyone of cheating, because either his alliance was too clueless to find out what everyone else has known for months, or they knew but neglected to share it with him.
    I bet its the 2nd option :P

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