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Thread: Multiple Account Change Postponed - Give us your thoughts!

  1. #41

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    Two things wrong with this:

    One: So, its only "Forever Free" for the first person who just happens to use the same IP..."Sorry Fred, you play from the local Starschmucks cafe, but so does Wilma, and she got here first. Pay up."

    Uh. No.


    Second: This game is by far the most expensive I've seen so far, not the least. Yes, those other games have expensive things you can buy, but those expensive things tend to be cosmetic "extra's" and ubertweaked gear, NOT things actually necessary to advance in the game.
    Well, they said, in this thread, that they are implementing account limiting measures to individual systems, not IP addresses:
    "This change will not affect players who use the same IP or network." - Dawnseeker
    So I don't understand your first point.

    As for your second point, how is the game free forever if it costs you more than any other game in order to advance? I have no idea how this could be true without making the price for additional accounts completely negligible in the face of these other costs you speak of.

    I'm proposing a business-minded solution to a problem that deals with game fairness, under the assumption that the technology to implement it exists. The main problem with this idea would revolve around how exactly they keep track of individual systems instead of IPs. What do you do if the user reformats, changes network cards, etc? This is a problem that has to be addressed for their multiple accounts policy anyway, but would become critically important if real world money was involved.

    As for MAC address identification... pretty sure that you can only detect the MAC of a router from outside the network, and not the systems behind it. Otherwise, you'd have the least secure network on the planet. But, that was still a good guess!

  2. #42

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    Quote Originally Posted by StormWolf View Post
    Sadly, this is the only workable compromise. Is it then more fair to allow cheaters to continue cheating?
    "
    ok so some people murder other people so lets just lock everyoine up in jail. after all, that is the only way to stop murders from murdering isnt it?

  3. #43

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    Quote Originally Posted by frogburger View Post
    Otherwise, you'd have the least secure network on the planet. But, that was still a good guess!
    what like those $30 walmart linksys routers lol?

  4. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by frogburger View Post
    Well, they said, in this thread, that they are implementing account limiting measures to individual systems, not IP addresses:
    "This change will not affect players who use the same IP or network." - Dawnseeker
    So I don't understand your first point.

    As for your second point, how is the game free forever if it costs you more than any other game in order to advance? I have no idea how this could be true without making the price for additional accounts completely negligible in the face of these other costs you speak of.

    I'm proposing a business-minded solution to a problem that deals with game fairness, under the assumption that the technology to implement it exists. The main problem with this idea would revolve around how exactly they keep track of individual systems instead of IPs. What do you do if the user reformats, changes network cards, etc? This is a problem that has to be addressed for their multiple accounts policy anyway, but would become critically important if real world money was involved.

    As for MAC address identification... pretty sure that you can only detect the MAC of a router from outside the network, and not the systems behind it. Otherwise, you'd have the least secure network on the planet. But, that was still a good guess!
    I was responding to skanktyme's comment.

    Yes, I'm well aware of the fact that this game really isn't "free forever". Please read my reponse a bit more carefully.


    Quote Originally Posted by skanktyme View Post
    ok so some people murder other people so lets just lock everyoine up in jail. after all, that is the only way to stop murders from murdering isnt it?
    To this, I can only blink and stare.

    The issue here is, How does Evony curtail multi cheating, while still allowing those on a shared-IP network to play. What you seem to be advocating is to allow the cheaters to continue playing, because "Hey, we'd have to lock them all out of the game...both the cheating and the non-cheating same-IP users."
    U noć idem, sjećanje jedan trn od zalosne, dalje prema smrti.
    Into the night I go, memory a thorn of sorrow, onward toward death.


    Death feels like the butterfly, can't escape the scarred lie
    ~Skinny Puppy: haZe~


    So, drifting through the dark
    The sympathy of night's mercy inside my heart
    Is your life the same? Do ghosts cry tears? Do they feel years?
    As time just goes on and on and on

    ~TransSiberian Orchestra: Back to a Reason, pt2~

  5. #45

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    Actually StormWolf, you were dismissing what I was saying, since the part I quoted you on was directly responding to something you wrote after quoting me. Also, I clearly read your response fine. Let's not get antagonistic here.

    Allowing multiple accounts may not be a huge deal for player fairness, but would certainly make it less likely that someone would pay real world money for things they could obtain for free by using an alt with beginner's protection (like enormous amounts of resources). This would break the business model, which would cause financial problems for the distributor. That's why charging money for multiple accounts on the same system (not IP), could potentially solve some problems. It would still be "free forever", just not "bankrupt within a year".

  6. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by frogburger View Post
    Actually StormWolf, you were dismissing what I was saying, since the part I quoted you on was directly responding to something you wrote after quoting me. Also, I clearly read your response fine. Let's not get antagonistic here.

    Allowing multiple accounts may not be a huge deal for player fairness, but would certainly make it less likely that someone would pay real world money for things they could obtain for free by using an alt with beginner's protection (like enormous amounts of resources). This would break the business model, which would cause financial problems for the distributor. That's why charging money for multiple accounts on the same system (not IP), could potentially solve some problems. It would still be "free forever", just not "bankrupt within a year".

    Didn't mean to sound antagonistic. It's getting a bit hard to keep track of who is saying what to which comments without going back and reading 4 pages back again...

    Anyhow...the point I am trying to make with your idea to charge for any account past the 1st one on the same IP is this:

    Lets say Fred joins Evony while using a computer at the local Starschmucks. He has responded to a banner ad he saw on one of the bazillion sites Evony has advertised on, so the game automatically assigns him to the next available server. Suddenly, a message pops up telling him that to continue playing, he is going to need to cough up some dough for a supposedly "free forever" game. He stares in shock for awhile, and then gives up...never to come back to Evony.

    What happened? Well, unbeknown to Fred, Wilma, another avid gamer, who also plays and surfs the 'net from the same Starschmucks, registered for Evony a short time before Fred did, and was also directed to the same server...thus filling the "one account per IP, per server" rule idea.

    Follow this a bit further. Basically, what this would mean is that every player in a dorm, college computer lab, cafe or other public computer network where another player has already registered and been directed to the same server, will then be told they have to pay...because they apparently already have an account.

    This is a good business model, how?
    U noć idem, sjećanje jedan trn od zalosne, dalje prema smrti.
    Into the night I go, memory a thorn of sorrow, onward toward death.


    Death feels like the butterfly, can't escape the scarred lie
    ~Skinny Puppy: haZe~


    So, drifting through the dark
    The sympathy of night's mercy inside my heart
    Is your life the same? Do ghosts cry tears? Do they feel years?
    As time just goes on and on and on

    ~TransSiberian Orchestra: Back to a Reason, pt2~

  7. #47

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    Quote Originally Posted by skanktyme View Post
    the person who gets it is the computer requesting. The router knows the mac address but it doesnt let that info out that is private. A cookie might be able to tell but that cookie would be flagged by and spyware or malware scanner as getting system info and sending it out is a no no, especially if a user is not informed that is happening. I would be inclined to report evony to badware
    Please let me clarify. I have no idea what method the devs will use to prohibit same-computer resource/troop sharing. I merely came up with an example that would be unintrusive.

    The cookie would not have to read your MAC address or anything like that, the cookie could simply say: "Evony Account: JohnDoe" and then if you logged in on another account, it would add that account cookie "Evony Account: JaneDoe" as well and then the game could see that your computer had 2 Account cookies and then flag those accounts to not allow resource/troop exchanges.

    I'm sure this is not how the devs are doing things, and my view is overly simplistic. My point was to give an example of a method that would be completely unintrusive, but would still accomplish the task of preventing multi-account resource trading on the same computer.

    Rest assured that privacy intrusion is not at all necessary to accomplish this task, so please lay this fear to rest.
    Legendary Hero

  8. #48

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    I see. You are still thinking that this is an IP-tracking system, when Dawnseeker explicitly said it is not (and would know, having started the thread and working for the distributor).

    Therefore, you could have a billion different systems log in at St*rb*cks, even simultaneously, and each one would still have free access, because Evony can differentiate between each system on that one IP. I don't know how, because Dawnseeker basically said "magic", and this what most people in this thread are now asking questions about. But, they can and are doing this. So that is not an issue, it works in that sense.

    Now, if you were to log in to a second "feeder" account while at St*rb*cks (in order to cheat it up a bit), then and only then would you be hit with a "multiple accounts on the same system cost extra money" notification. Of course, you could just as well be passing your laptop to your mate so that they could play, so that would be a legitimate second account from the same system. However, five bucks is not a huge deal for such a privilege. It is a huge deal if you have 10,000 feeder accounts and each costs you an additional $5 to log in to.

    Since people would have to pay for feeder accounts, it would no longer be "cheating", it would be the same as paying for any other advantage in the game, and the company would stand no risk of losing players or profitability.

    Remember, system-level restrictions are being implemented right now, not IP-level restrictions. IP addresses don't matter.

  9. #49

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    err...that was meant to come after StormWolf's reply...

  10. #50
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    My sisters boyfriend basically lives in my house and when im not about uses my latop to connect to his account, i need to know that all our time that has been placed in our two accounts will be safe from deletion.

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