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Thread: What's ruining Evony?

  1. Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MichDry View Post
    Lastly we return to number 3. Can you really call yourself uber if you use cheats and/or exploits? There isn't a single person on an establish server who can say they are in the top % of their server's players who doesn't cheat/exploit some how. Not a critisism so much as blunt honesty. Evony can run the numbers. Manually the only person who could maybe be so uber is a professional typist (not data entry but actuel 160+ words a minute typist).
    I assure that is 100% incorrect! There are alot of cheats, yes - however there are consistantly top 10/100 players who use there heads in game opposed to using third-party software - you'll find a great deal of these players are PAYING for Evony, such as myself.

    The same is with my daughter, who is paying $70 each server she goes on, and at 13 years old, she has been top 10 on most servers she's played.

    Maybe a superior strategy can also be called into question here? Opposed to tarring every great player on Evony with the same brush.

    Oh and, I like your ideas - the Bot one especially, and if introduced will greatly benefit the majority of us. (REP ADDED)
    Regards

    DieKaiser
    --
    Protect your Privacy | Stop Phorm | www.badphorm.co.uk | www.nodpi.org | www.StopPhorm.bebo.com | www.dephormation.org.uk | www.savetheinternet.com

  2. #12

    Default Slow down with that paintbrush

    Quote Originally Posted by MichDry View Post
    and everyone on any establishd server who is a major player, is cheating, you've ruined the game and imho have the play ability of a 9yo who steals money/realestate in the monopoly game or uses cheat codes on video games. While you can wreck anyone who isn't as big a cheater as you, your tactics usually suck and the main reason you've learned combo's of what to send is because you have so many troops it doesn't matter what you make and waste. Something you'd never have been able to learn by playing evony by it's rules. Do I hold the players accountable for cheating? No, they wanna play the game and "win" and if the only way to win is to cheat more then the next guy then you do what you gotta do.
    Stating "everyone" is quite offensive. The most "cheating" I have done is I spent money and got the best deal that they had, the 15-week Premium Rewards. You can call that "cheating" if you wish, but it isn't. It wasn't the brightest thing I've done either, but it is what it is. I had the option. As for farming, I do that by doing all of the mouse clicking manually, no bots, no tools that could be used for screen macros, nothing. Just me, myself, and I.


    High Heroes. Either make all heroes max out to 200 in each ability or the following
    Buy a hero for $10 per 100 levels up to 300, plus an additional 100 levels per 6mos age of server. Have the hero be marked special so you may only have 1such hero per account.
    So, in your fit of jealousy, you want to punish people who may have actually sat here for many hours and did all the attacking to get higher level heroes too? You're mad because you "don't have the time", so those that do should be punished?

    Only other way to get another 300+ hero should be to raise them normally from scratch
    Wait, you just said that heroes should be capped at 200, so you could not "raise them normally from scratch" to 300, could you?

    This allows a casual player to now learn how to farm lv10's too and gives him/her the chance to at least defend decently
    Ah. Here is your real complaint. You got hit by a bully. I'm sorry that happened, but not everyone who has several 250+ attack heroes is a bully, just like they are also not all "cheaters".

    Lastly we return to number 3. Can you really call yourself uber if you use cheats and/or exploits? There isn't a single person on an establish server who can say they are in the top % of their server's players who doesn't cheat/exploit some how.
    I can, and your accusations otherwise make me tune out the rest of your post, even though you may have valid concerns in regards to people who indeed are cheating.

    You need to knock off the rehtoric and realize that SOME, not ALL, people cheat. Those that do cheat need to be dealt with. Paying money is *NOT* a cheat. The Premium Rewards thing was a ridiculously fantastic deal. In the middle of people complaining on here about how they were "ripped off" or whatever because they didn't get what they bought, I got a drop of Evony cents into my game account at the same time of the day on the same day of the week for 15 straight weeks, and exactly the amount that the agreement said I would get. If you did not take advantage of it when you could've, sorry. If you could not financially afford it or did not want to spend money, I understand that, but it does not give you the right to call someone a cheater, nor does it make your ideas valid. Again, I'm sorry you were bullied, but not everyone at the top of the stats for each server is a bully.
    Last edited by neko_lord; 11-23-2009 at 05:23 PM.

  3. #13

    Default

    i want to understand how a lvl7 city w/ 15oo to 2000 AT's can be taken out in on fight by an army in the open, real life, it would not happen, and having to wait for an attack to come is wrong...i should be able to ambush an incoming army..it would make this game a whole lot better, if the odds were a little mor in the favor of the defending cities..

  4. #14

    Default

    if odds were any *more* in favor of defending cities, the game would cease to be a war game, and would become Sim City. Seriously.. Either you lack even a basic understanding of game mechanics, or the logic to process them adequately.

    Far as "real life" goes... Taking out a city that's relying only on 1500-2000 AT's would be child's play. Static defense was made obsolete well over a century ago now, and the Romans proved the limits of fortification as a defense a couple thousand years before that.

    Consider that I, a no-life, out-of-shape geek with a bad back, could build a medium scale trebuchet in my back yard that could lob a bowling ball well farther than a person can shoot an arrow... A motivated person with half a brain and a knowledge of highschool physics, with a small army of laborers, could easly produce enough artillery to level your vaunted "2k ATs" in fairly short order. And they wouldn't keep walking into enemy firing range either, and they'd have a pike screen and some armsmen to defend against charges on their position.

    A couple of sneaky types could infiltrate your city and poison your wells... hot air balloons carrying plague-bearing fleas could be sent over your walls... the walls themselves could be undermined and weaken by sapper units... there's a hundred ways to crack a nut to get at the juicy meat inside, and all of its been done a thousand times thoughout history. Educate yourself before you start whining about how "attackers have too much advantage".

    In evony, attacks are limited to an absolute *maximum* of 125k troops per wave.. yet a defender can have 1 million archers garissoning his city, gaining range advantage from the walls. Take that city, I dare you. Not saying it's impossible.. just nearly so, unless you have a *vast* numerical superiority you are willing to bleed dry for it. You will lose wave after wave after wave after wave.. and maybe after 50 waves or so, you might have him worn down a bit. Tell me that this is "biased in favor of the attacker."

    But anyway... before we got into the noob whine-fest.. bits were made about the game getting boring, cheaters, etc...

    1. Captchas don't work. They can be circumvented by computer now. They're still used because they give the "illusion" of security, and they cut down on the amount of idiots spamming and the like.. Now only smart people can effectively spam past a captcha... but the tech is out there.

    2. Raiding level 10 npcs is *not* that terribly difficult. You need a level 10 rally point, 95k archers, 1k sword, 1k pike, and 2k transports. Plus an attack hero in the 130-150 range. If you have compass 8 or 9, you'll lose your rainbow plus 6-8k archers on average.. if you have compass 10, you'll lose probably 20-30k. Assuming all other relevant techs at 10.

    is it explicitly cost effective? no. It relies on a certain level of resource and troop production to provide advantage.. But it's certainly doable and effective if done right. There's no "cheating" involved, just certain people smart enough to read the forums and learn how to do it.

    The medal drop thing is kind of irksome.. especially as NPC10's no longer drop them on the upper numbered servers. :/

    [edit] Oh, one more thing.. a 300 atk hero isn't that hard to get. It takes time, and some patience, and being smarter than your keyboard. There are numerous threads in the guide forum that can show you some very interesting ways to level a hero up.. I'll have a hero at 200 atk within a week, completely legit.. I've got 12 more at the 110-120 range.. probably have that main hero at 300+ atk within a month. Like anything worthwhile, it just takes some effort put into it. [/edit]
    Last edited by Druegan; 11-23-2009 at 06:35 PM. Reason: thought of something else.
    <19:42>[DPS]: can i have the coords of that 'real life' please.. i'dd like to scout it

  5. #15

    Default careful with your paintbrush too

    Quote Originally Posted by TentPig View Post
    It is my personal opinion that all the top-level players "cheat"... The top-level players all have armies that number into the millions (maybe even 10's of millions), and I see no viable way within Evony for some of these players to maintain the army sizes they do without cheating.

    I do not see how NPC farming lvl 10 NPCs is viable -- even with a 260 ATK hero I see army losses which, in order to regenerate those loses you need more resources than you gather from the farming activity itself.
    The problem here is you appear to either be only looking at the food/iron/lumber gained and ignoring the gold, or ignoring that lvl 5 attacks can be done by only expending food for the march...

    Basically, what you think is "cheating" works like this:

    1) Farm multiple lvl 5s to get food, lumber, iron, and gold.
    2) Farm lvl 10s to get food and experience to level up heroes, as well as gold.
    3) Watch the market for good times to use the gold to buy lumber and iron.
    4) Use acquired lumber and iron to assist building more.

    What also helps is if you happen to be in a peaceful area, as you can just do steps 1-4 above over and over and over.

    People can go on and on about how the game was "not supposed to be that way", but you have to make a decision about if you're going to whine about it or do what others do so as to be able to have the larger army for defensive purposes.

    That said, what I see are people who are at the top and did get there legitimately simply become "bored" after a period of time, so either they flat out quit or they turn into roaming attack cities by using teleporters. That ends up making them so that they appear to be "bullies" or "cheaters", spawning threads like this one.

    Lastly, it's always "cool" to rage against someone at the top. People do it all the time. Classic example as for a person and a company is Bill Gates and Microsoft. Whether or not he/they deserve the amount of anger that gets aimed at them isn't the point. It's the point that a large portion of society gets jealous enough to where they want to punish success.

  6. #16
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    I don't think Evony is boring at all. Evony might never become balance, since, well, there will always be people who'll sneak around botting, but, Evony is still good enough to be called a "good" and "fun" online game.

  7. #17

    Thumbs down Army sizes

    1. The top players have found ways to increase armies to a point no one can attack and even think of winning.
    Solution:
    The troops have a predetermined value already. Therefore limit the total value that can be allowed in a single barrack. This will limit the overall size of the players army.

    Increase the output of the resources from the fields in the city example: food triple output, lumber, stone and iron double output.

    On player make npc's limit number that can be made and delete them after 7 days so they have to recapture
    Henry

  8. #18

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by neko_lord View Post
    The problem here is you appear to either be only looking at the food/iron/lumber gained and ignoring the gold, or ignoring that lvl 5 attacks can be done by only expending food for the march...

    Basically, what you think is "cheating" works like this:
    Please do not put words in my mouth. I have never asserted that farming NPCs is "cheating".

    I have stated that I don't see how farming lvl 10 NPCs is cost-effective, in terms of resources-gained vs. troops lost.

    You are correct I didn't factor gold into the equation. However, I still feel it is a nominal difference... 1.5mil gold buys 150k iron or lumber on my server at current prices, which translates into another 215 archers.

    Thus, with 600k lumber/iron gained, I can regen 1714 (600k) + 215 (75k), or roughly 1930 archers from an NPC lvl 10 run.

    In the long term this seems cost ineffective... In order to make up the troop loss (including the rainbows) I would have to farm several lvl 5's on top of the lvl 10 just to get the resources required to rebuild the troops.

    IMO it seems easier to simply hit multiple lvl 5's with no losses.

    Unless I'm missing something, that is. I'm always open to new ideas, so if I've missed something obvious, by all means please enlighten me.

  9. #19

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by TentPig View Post
    Please do not put words in my mouth. I have never asserted that farming NPCs is "cheating".
    No, you said "all top-level players cheat". I explained, as a top-level player on my server, how I "cheat", which isn't cheating at all, which you seem to agree isn't cheating by what I just quoted.

    My point was you and the OP are making sweeping generalizations about people who you do not even know. Are there cheaters? Most certainly. Is everyone at the top of the rankings on every server a cheater? No.

    I have stated that I don't see how farming lvl 10 NPCs is cost-effective, in terms of resources-gained vs. troops lost.
    In and of itself, it's not. However just because you have been unable to put all the pieces together does not grant you the right to make sweeping generalizations about people.


    You are correct I didn't factor gold into the equation. However, I still feel it is a nominal difference... 1.5mil gold buys 150k iron or lumber on my server at current prices, which translates into another 215 archers.

    Thus, with 600k lumber/iron gained, I can regen 1714 (600k) + 215 (75k), or roughly 1930 archers from an NPC lvl 10 run.

    In the long term this seems cost ineffective... In order to make up the troop loss (including the rainbows) I would have to farm several lvl 5's on top of the lvl 10 just to get the resources required to rebuild the troops.
    Yay! I think that's what I said in my step 1 through step 4. I'll repeat:

    1) Farm multiple lvl 5s to get food, lumber, iron, and gold.
    2) Farm lvl 10s to get food and experience to level up heroes, as well as gold.
    3) Watch the market for good times to use the gold to buy lumber and iron.
    4) Use acquired lumber and iron to assist building more.


    IMO it seems easier to simply hit multiple lvl 5's with no losses.
    Once you get to a certain point, you need the extra food that 10s provide. Additionally, this is the only way to significantly increase a hero's level once it passes around 400k for a single level up. You can hit a 5 with no losses for around 93k of experience, so you need 5 lvl 5s for each level up once the next level requires 400k. Contrast that with 1.8M experience for a single victory against a lvl 10.

    Unless I'm missing something, that is. I'm always open to new ideas, so if I've missed something obvious, by all means please enlighten me.
    Yes, you've missed a lot that's obvious. Just because you don't fully understand how to play doesn't mean that people that are ahead of you are all "cheaters".

  10. #20
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    I would like to remind everyone to please show courtesy and respect to your fellow players when posting here. If this becomes a flame war, the discussion will not be allowed to continue.

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