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Thread: A query.

  1. #1

    Default A query.

    So...this is totally a hypothetical situation. Nothing below is in any way related to anything that has ever happened to me or anyone I know. I will however, relate the question in first person, to make the explanation easier.

    I played Evony for several months, and loved it. I spend $100 on the game and reached a point that I was satisfied with, and decided to leave the game. I gave someone my log in email and PW several months ago, because I was not interested in playing the account anymore. It's against the rules, I'm aware.

    The person I gave my account to was a full time player with multiple accounts who ran the bot 24/7 in order to keep up with daily maintenance. The agreement was that the new owner of the account would not attack anyone in my alliance. The new owner put more money on the account after they began to play it full time. I logged on this evening to find them attacking my alliance. The account I logged in on is new account, registered from a different email address, technically making me a multi-accounter. It's against the rules, I'm aware.

    I logged back onto the original account, changed the PW and attacked back at the person who had my account (their other account). They were online and reinforced, so I quickly stopped. Now their alliance is bombarding me with whispers and mails (and attacks!) claiming they are.... lol....just a sec....LOL

    ....going to file charges of credit card fraud against me. They claim that the account was sold over ebay from me to the new owner. This is entirely untrue. There is zero evidence suggesting that any such transaction took place. They also claim that since the new owner put $$$ on the account, I broke the law when I logged on and changed the PW.

    Foxy....will you give everyone a quick summary as to what happens when people break the rules, as in this hypothetical example? I'm not entirely aware of how and why and who and what, but I'm certain that any transfer of accounts violates the ToS. Could you give us all a quick recap?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    May 2009
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    Default

    I would be happy to:

    First of all, transfer of an account by selling, buying, gifting, "accidentally" leaving the login information on a scrap of paper stuck under a park bench, or any other method is a violation of our Terms & Conditions and Evony does not honor such transfers.

    Second, I'd be very interested to see how someone would press charges of credit card fraud for an illegal transaction. Let me test this: I'm gonna call the police and say that my drug dealer totally ripped me off and this cocaine is NOT pure. Someone bail me out of jail please? An account transfer isn't going to net you jail time, but we'll probably just ban the account to stop the fight and ebay will laugh you off the server.

    Now, if the original owner of the account should exercise the "Forgot Password" feature and retrieve his account, since Evony acknowledges no transfer of the account, he's well within his rights. The "purchaser" just got sacked, and it's his own fault for violating the T&C. We'll not give him any sympathy.

    And finally, if the original owner should happen to be able to provide any kind of proof of botting or other illegal activities on the various accounts in question, we'd likely go on a banning spree and send everyone packing. And no, we don't really care if you maxed out your credit card on the accounts. You cheat, you get banned.

  3. #3

    Default

    Thanks for the quick and timely response, Madame Foxy.

    I'll be sure to come directly to you with all my future queries regarding the legality of Evony and players actions.

  4. #4
    Join Date
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    LOL Gosh, thanks Mont.

    I have to wonder if that's a compliment or a threat....

  5. #5

    Default

    Neither. I was just impressed by the way I sang out your name and you instantly appeared. It's reassuring.

    edit: Oh, I guess I have more questions.

    So, in order to prove someone is running the bot....

    How trustworthy are screenshots of in game mails, whispers or gmail/gchat conversation? They're easily shooped. Can you actually use screenshots to form a case?
    Last edited by montedison; 11-23-2009 at 11:30 PM.

  6. #6
    Join Date
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    The screenshots are great because they give us a server time and we know the server number. We use them as a reference to pull up the actual message/chat/mail from our server logs and verify the information. A screenshot in itself is not proof because they are too easily photoshopped. A screenshot can save us a whole heck of a lot of time in an investigation though.

    And yes, if the player is admitting to botting, that's pretty solid evidence to start with. A quick check of account activity by the devs and we can confirm.

  7. #7

    Default

    Interesting. What about the multitude of accounts sold on eBay and other sites since April? Evony doesn't seem to step in and stop the auctions as some game companies do. Of the many sold, how many have been re-taken by the original owners of the account here in the game? I find it unlikely that there have been no prior complaints of this nature and if the stance that Evony takes is that the original owner has the rightful claim in their eyes, then it should be better posted, and a notice given to the auction sites that transfer is prohibited.

    Also, eBay regards the sales as legal transactions and so do the CC companies, the goods, though they are virtual in nature, are still a legal commodity. Even if Evony chose not to recognize the purchaser's rights, the original owner would still have committed a fraudulent action in selling the account for money, while holding the intent to reclaim it. They did not lease the account for a specified term, they *sold* it.

    - just a bystander going hmmmmm

  8. #8
    Join Date
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    Oh, I'm not saying the original owner didn't commit a fraudulent act, but the purchaser is going to have a darn hard time saying he now "owns" the account or getting his money back. My understanding is that we most certainly have notified the various auction sites that selling of Evony accounts is a violation of our Terms, and we have stepped in to stop quite a few of these sales.

    It is basically a case where both parties have broken our rules, and therefore the most common action resulting from a dispute is simply to ban the account entirely. If you can't play nicely, we'll take the toy away.

  9. #9

    Default

    Thank you for your quick reply. That would seem fair I suppose, and of course the CC companies would do their chargebacks, and the various other forms, receipts and such would be used as evidence in the criminal proceedings for the act.

    Good to hear that Evony is stepping in on the auction sites as well. Perhaps some additonal effort would be called for? I was worried as it seemed from the original statment that Evony would see it as simply the originator's account and that's that...which could in turn open the company to a civil suit supporting the false sales of accounts. Banning the account entirely and deleting it from the server? That would suit all parties I'm sure.

  10. #10

    Default

    More specifically, it isn't your account to sell on ebay.

    Selling something that isn't yours is fraud.

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